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lol at Waterloo Engineering Student

A photo of Slasher61 Slasher61
I have this friend who is in engineering at Waterloo, this kid is an absolute genious. One issue though, he is very very unorganized. His most recent facebook status says "staying home for 4 more months after christmas". His reason was he missed to many classes for some reason, therefore, Waterloo made him take a reduced course load which can't be done until after the second term. Its sad but so funny.
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A photo of ktel ktel
^ Sounds like he got put on academic probation for low grades. Not many schools I know of have an attendance policy. Being a genius doesn't amount to much if you can't organize yourself enough to apply it.
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A photo of mechboyy mechboyy
A lof of people came into Waterloo thinking they were the best. Its true many were the top 3% of their school and whatnot but seriously, I know people who took IB,AP, did integrals, you name it and are still having a hard time with the program. One thing I learned in Waterloo is that people like to talk out of their ass a lot and over boost themselves about what they've done and whatnot... the truth it, EVERYONE THAT GOT IN WAS MODERATELY SMART. Now that you're in, its not a matter about how smart you are, its a matter of DEDICATION and work ethic and this takes people by surprise. Also, I realized the variation in high school. An 85 in one high school is definitely not a 85 in another. Many people came in with 97 average and are barely getting a 60.. Also, the class average for all the exams for my mechanical division was 60ish for all the exams (except physics was 52). Obviously if the class avrg is 60 and the average to get into engineering was an 85 minimum its safe to say that half the class has already experienced a 25% drop or more from their grade 12 marks. Im not trying to scare you but thats just the reality..
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A photo of rightsaidfred rightsaidfred
It's not enough to be brilliant. You have to work hard.
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A photo of konhee93 konhee93
They make you take that if your midterm average was below 50 and they dont think you'll be able to get your marks up by finals... And I think he's staying home cuz he couldnt find a coop job.
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A photo of n0y0x n0y0x

@mechboyy wrote
A lof of people came into Waterloo thinking they were the best. Its true many were the top 3% of their school and whatnot but seriously, I know people who took IB,AP, did integrals, you name it and are still having a hard time with the program. One thing I learned in Waterloo is that people like to talk out of their ass a lot and over boost themselves about what they've done and whatnot... the truth it, EVERYONE THAT GOT IN WAS MODERATELY SMART. Now that you're in, its not a matter about how smart you are, its a matter of DEDICATION and work ethic and this takes people by surprise. Also, I realized the variation in high school. An 85 in one high school is definitely not a 85 in another. Many people came in with 97 average and are barely getting a 60.. Also, the class average for all the exams for my mechanical division was 60ish for all the exams (except physics was 52). Obviously if the class avrg is 60 and the average to get into engineering was an 85 minimum its safe to say that half the class has already experienced a 25% drop or more from their grade 12 marks. Im not trying to scare you but thats just the reality..



This!!!!

Also, waterloo eng does not care about attendance. Some classes have iclicker based marks though.
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A photo of Slasher61 Slasher61

@konhee93 wrote
They make you take that if your midterm average was below 50 and they dont think you'll be able to get your marks up by finals... And I think he's staying home cuz he couldnt find a coop job.



He can't do his coop cause he needs to complete first year before he can start.
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A photo of konhee93 konhee93

@Slasher61 wrote

@konhee93 wrote
They make you take that if your midterm average was below 50 and they dont think you'll be able to get your marks up by finals... And I think he's staying home cuz he couldnt find a coop job.



He can't do his coop cause he needs to complete first year before he can start.



Uhm no...? He's in stream 4 im guessing if he was gonna coop.
I know friends who are in reduced course load who's planning to work next term (January).
If he's in stream 8, nvm idk
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A photo of iRamie iRamie

@konhee93 wrote

@Slasher61 wrote

@konhee93 wrote
They make you take that if your midterm average was below 50 and they dont think you'll be able to get your marks up by finals... And I think he's staying home cuz he couldnt find a coop job.



He can't do his coop cause he needs to complete first year before he can start.



Uhm no...? He's in stream 4 im guessing if he was gonna coop.
I know friends who are in reduced course load who's planning to work next term (January).
If he's in stream 8, nvm idk



Are there a lot of co op jobs for environmental engineering?
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A photo of Slasher61 Slasher61

@konhee93 wrote

@Slasher61 wrote

@konhee93 wrote
They make you take that if your midterm average was below 50 and they dont think you'll be able to get your marks up by finals... And I think he's staying home cuz he couldnt find a coop job.



He can't do his coop cause he needs to complete first year before he can start.



Uhm no...? He's in stream 4 im guessing if he was gonna coop.
I know friends who are in reduced course load who's planning to work next term (January).
If he's in stream 8, nvm idk



Funny because he knows more about his own situation than you do and he told me. He's being moved into reduced course load starting in May or June.
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A photo of aimango aimango
This is actually a common occurrence for Waterloo Engineering (meaning, it's not a surprise that 10% of the class drops out or switches down to an easier major each term). Reason being: our schedules are about twice as loaded as students in other faculties, and yes if you dont maintain a certain average and fail a certain amount of courses, you have to repeat a term. Our faculty is extremely strict about these things.

You will notice in Faculty of Math, you are allowed to DROP 2 courses, allowing you to be "Full-time" with 3 courses, but Engineering -> you cannot drop any courses. 5 is the minimum, as you get into upper years, 6 is the minimum for certain terms. A lot of people fail out in 1B and 2A... really depends on your program, 1A is not as common because many courses have a lot of review content.

You dont necessarily have to be a hard worker to do well in Engineering, you might be "lucky" and ride the bell multiple times. Being naturally smart (ie. understand things as soon as it is taught) helps of course.

And attendance is only recommended, but if there are course notes or mandatory tutorials, you might just be fine.
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A photo of Slasher61 Slasher61

@aimango wrote
This is actually a common occurrence for Waterloo Engineering (meaning, it's not a surprise that 10% of the class drops out or switches down to an easier major each term). Reason being: our schedules are about twice as loaded as students in other faculties, and yes if you dont maintain a certain average and fail a certain amount of courses, you have to repeat a term. Our faculty is extremely strict about these things.

You will notice in Faculty of Math, you are allowed to DROP 2 courses, allowing you to be "Full-time" with 3 courses, but Engineering -> you cannot drop any courses. 5 is the minimum, as you get into upper years, 6 is the minimum for certain terms. A lot of people fail out in 1B and 2A... really depends on your program, 1A is not as common because many courses have a lot of review content.

You dont necessarily have to be a hard worker to do well in Engineering, you might be "lucky" and ride the bell multiple times. Being naturally smart (ie. understand things as soon as it is taught) helps of course.

And attendance is only recommended, but if there are course notes or mandatory tutorials, you might just be fine.


Both him and another friend of mine compared schedules, and the one attending Waterloo had approximately 40 hours of class, lectures, etc. Where as my other friedn who attends queen's :thumbdown ... had close to 24 hours of classes and such.
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A photo of ktel ktel
^ Both in engineering?
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A photo of mechboyy mechboyy

@aimango wrote
This is actually a common occurrence for Waterloo Engineering (meaning, it's not a surprise that 10% of the class drops out or switches down to an easier major each term). Reason being: our schedules are about twice as loaded as students in other faculties, and yes if you dont maintain a certain average and fail a certain amount of courses, you have to repeat a term. Our faculty is extremely strict about these things.

You will notice in Faculty of Math, you are allowed to DROP 2 courses, allowing you to be "Full-time" with 3 courses, but Engineering -> you cannot drop any courses. 5 is the minimum, as you get into upper years, 6 is the minimum for certain terms. A lot of people fail out in 1B and 2A... really depends on your program, 1A is not as common because many courses have a lot of review content.

You dont necessarily have to be a hard worker to do well in Engineering, you might be "lucky" and ride the bell multiple times. Being naturally smart (ie. understand things as soon as it is taught) helps of course.

And attendance is only recommended, but if there are course notes or mandatory tutorials, you might just be fine.



I also just want to add that the pass for 1A is now a 60% overall in order to move on to the next term. Previous years it was 50... so its even more pressure now.
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A photo of aimango aimango
^ yep. i know about that. actually our year is pretty lucky, think we were the only year with a >50% = pass for first year, because before us it's always been 60%, too.
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A photo of greygoose greygoose

@ktel wrote
^ Both in engineering?



I also want to add a bit of a note to the 40 hour/week engineering schedule; for those engineering hopefuls, don't let it scare you away from the field.

I've actually followed some of these engineering classes, for the lulz (accidentally--they spill into the classrooms I was in before their class, and I just hang around). One of the main reasons they have so much "official" class is because of their labs. It's actually very much like high school in a sense. Because cheating is so rampant in engineering, the homework isn't worth any marks, or it's worth very few marks. Rather, they have a number of quizzes and labs due during the lab slot for each course, instead of what you might expect for labwork.

I call it similar to high school, because a large portion of the hours spent in "class" can actually be spent getting assignments out of the way. Whereas in any other faculty, every hour you spend in class will either be listening to a prof lecture, or perhaps working in the lab. Engineering is quite a bit more structured in this sense, which makes for an easier transition for many students.

I've also looked at the work the engineers do in their first and second term. It's pretty computational and pretty high volume in workload, but also easier than the equivalent courses taken in other faculties. So while these guys are taking 7 courses (eek!), each course is a bit easier to compensate. I've actually looked at the quizzes and whatnot and made a comparison--engineers per course do have an easier time, but take more in total which balances things out.

I mean, yes, engineers have an enormous workload. They have to have an incredible amount of discipline and drive. But it is doable. While I really respect engineers and their workloads, at the same time I don't want people to be worshiping them like gods or believing that they have the most difficult workloads in university, because they don't always; I also wouldn't want people to be scared away from the field for it. I'd say on average compared to other majors, they definitely claim the title of most difficult degree (though if you're really concerned with the global maximum, there are fields in mathematics and the sciences that take the cake).
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A photo of ktel ktel
I'm definitely not an advocate of giving the engineering schedule the ridiculous reputation that it gets, and I try to dispel that as much as possible, but for goodness sakes it's not a competition for whose degree is harder, which you're basically turning these discussions into. You haven't done an engineering degree, and I haven't done a math degree, so I provide no judgement on the difficulty of your degree, and you shouldn't provide judgement on the difficulty of mine.
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A photo of greygoose greygoose
Heh, you are right, this is not something anyone should bother caring about. Perhaps I came across too much that way.

One thing I've noticed is that people obsess over the "reputation" of a field or school or whatever. It is good to have a repertoire of "this is why my degree is harder/better" at your disposal when you need to placate idiots. There are points for both sides. Usually you need to be able to argue this one to justify your degree choice to... oh, I don't know, parents maybe.

What I really dislike when people claim that xxx is 100% superior or so hard compared to yyy, which is what this kind of degenerated into. For every one of these "engineering is sooooo hard my genious (sic) friend failed lolol" I have one for science, one for mathematics, one for computer science, etc... you get the idea. Thus, anecdotes to keep things balanced.

I mean, really, this whole thread is totally irrelevant, but look at the number of posts... newsflash, engineering is hard, so is pretty much every other major worth studying at university, some degrees have bigger numbers to flash around to try to show they're hard. /thread

EDIT: The other thing I should add is that the worry is that when people hear that engineers put in 40 hours a week in classes when others put in less than half that for lectures, and they might be scared away from the field. They shouldn't be. I am not so much trying to say HAHA THIS IS BETTER/HARDER/WHATEVER but say that "everything is about equally hard, maybe if you want to be pedantic such and such is harder/more workload etc. but none of this should scare you away from it because you'll be working an equal amount either way".
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A photo of ktel ktel
Yup, the kids on this forum are in general young, inexperienced, and desperately wanting some ego boosting. And thus it becomes a "my degree is harder/better/faster/stronger" argument.
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A photo of aimango aimango
I thought the point of this thread was for the OP to lol @ smart people failing. WHICH HAPPENS. Most of you are in high school and are probably top 10% of your class, so you really wouldn't expect something like that to happen to you.

The workload that engineers go through IS scary the first time they come across it, and either people are slackers or people get stressed easily without time management. That's all it really is... I don't really complain about my #hrs/week anymore as I'm used to it...

And think about it like this -> If youre in a Biomed program, you likely want to get into medicine, optometry, etc. Thus, your university marks still matter to you. Engineering... well we don't need to go into grad school. So we dont really care. Or at least, that's the mindset of a LARGE portion of my class. Guess I'm generalizing here but hope you get my point. No pain, no gain.

greygoose - Don't really understand your analogy to high school... High school is 9-230pm only... which is about the same number of hours a day for most university students, except high school = 20 min lesson, 40 min work period. All lectures in university are complete lessons. Labs are EXTRA, and sometimes have very little to do with course material. They can be annoying, time consuming, etc, but depending on the course, you'll just have labs and no graded assignments. Tutorials are also EXTRA, idk about other faculties but in first year engineering - most of them are mandatory. Once you're in upper year they don't really force you to go, they're just there to supplement your learning.
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A photo of greygoose greygoose

@aimango wrote
greygoose - Don't really understand your analogy to high school... High school is 9-230pm only... which is about the same number of hours a day for most university students, except high school = 20 min lesson, 40 min work period. All lectures in university are complete lessons. Labs are EXTRA, and sometimes have very little to do with course material. They can be annoying, time consuming, etc, but depending on the course, you'll just have labs and no graded assignments. Tutorials are also EXTRA, idk about other faculties but in first year engineering - most of them are mandatory. Once you're in upper year they don't really force you to go, they're just there to supplement your learning.



High school for me was 8:30 am to 3:30 pm; engineers usually have something similar, maybe with a tutorial in the evening. The hours are similar, and the work structure is similar, though a higher percentage goes to lectures. In HS, it was something like 60 minutes lesson, remaining 30 minutes for work, and you do see this kind of thing happening in labs. If you look at a science degree or a math degree or an arts degree, your lectures are new material only where you are expected to take notes for 1-3 hours, and you'll only spend maybe 3 hours in class a day. So the structure there is totally different.

What you said about labs and tutorials doesn't seem to contradict what I said, so I think our understanding is the same. I should note that very few other faculties really use tutorials--math has gotten rid of them for the most part because they're poorly attended, and while CS offers them, they are really aimed as remedial review for those doing poorly on assignments. Arts doesn't really have them in my experience, nor does science. Often, office hours will be held, but that's about it.

Basically, the labs and tutorials, at least for first year engineers, are tacked onto your classes and force you to spend time on the course, whereas in other faculties, that kind of thing doesn't happen :P
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A photo of Quiz Quiz

@mechboyy wrote
A lof of people came into Waterloo thinking they were the best. Its true many were the top 3% of their school and whatnot but seriously, I know people who took IB,AP, did integrals, you name it and are still having a hard time with the program. One thing I learned in Waterloo is that people like to talk out of their ass a lot and over boost themselves about what they've done and whatnot... the truth it, EVERYONE THAT GOT IN WAS MODERATELY SMART. Now that you're in, its not a matter about how smart you are, its a matter of DEDICATION and work ethic and this takes people by surprise. Also, I realized the variation in high school. An 85 in one high school is definitely not a 85 in another. Many people came in with 97 average and are barely getting a 60.. Also, the class average for all the exams for my mechanical division was 60ish for all the exams (except physics was 52). Obviously if the class avrg is 60 and the average to get into engineering was an 85 minimum its safe to say that half the class has already experienced a 25% drop or more from their grade 12 marks. Im not trying to scare you but thats just the reality..


+1
Lol, when I was in high school, I was under the delusion that I was a prodigy (I had top marks in most of my grade 12 subjects) and that I would go on to do amazing things.

Fast forward to my first year of university, and I nearly failed a class, and had many exams where I scored in the 50s and 60s (I also failed one with a 20-something). All the kids around me were doing loads better as well as maintaining strong extra-cirriculars, while I remained hidden in my room everyday trying to fight off depression, while trying to scrape through my courses. I also had no social life, I had poor sleep habits, and I had poor eating habits.

This year, aside from one class I had to drop due to poor marks, I am doing much better. I also have a social life + I work hard + I have extra-cirriculars + I am involved with research.

Just like the above poster said this is reality and I experienced it firsthand. I urge prospective undergraduates not to be misled into a false sense of secuity upon their grduation from secondary school.
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